Wallys 73 Malibu project

mikidymac wrote:Ok Wally yours looks awesome so now I have a lot of questions....

I have a 73 Chevelle SS that my dad bought new and was my first car. For my birthday my wife just ought me the same LS3/430 connect and cruise as you have. I don't want to do any cutting in case I ever want to go back to original so....

What oil pan did you use? Cutting involved?
What accessory drive did you use?
What headers did you use?
What engine mounts?

What did you do for A/C? I want to keep my interior all original but nobody makes a kit for ours. Big surprise!

While I dont have LS3 in mine, I may be able to help.  I used a Cadillac CTS-V oil pan ( http://www.improvedracing.com/oil-pan-swap-kits/complete-oil-pan-swap-kit-for-ls2-ls6-lsa-cadillac-cts-p-383.html ) and car shop 1" setback plates ( http://carshop.carshopinc.com/product_info.php/products_id/98457/CSP2370 ) and bolted the stock motor mounts right to the plates, which will put the engine in the stock location. Now with that setup the ctsv pan will hang down below the front crossmember about 3/4", but thats not near as bad as it would be if you were to use the GM pan marketed as the "muscle car" pan ( http://www.jegs.com/p/Chevrolet-Performance/Chevrolet-Performance-LS-Muscle-Car-Oil-Pan-Kits/1221210/10002/-1 ), which would hang down another 1" past the ctsv pan.  Ctsv= 6.75" deep vs the "muscle car" = 7.75" deep.

Cant really be much help on the headers as i used stock 02 camaro manifolds on mine, but I know BRP/hedman sells swap headers for our cars ( http://www.brphotrods.com/products/73-77%20A%20body%20products/index.html ) but I cant speak on fitment as Ive never used them.  And for the accessories a corvette FAD should fit the car and work with the waterpump thats already on the motor ( http://www.jegs.com/i/Chevrolet-Performance/809/19155067/10002/-1 )

alowerlevel wrote:

mikidymac wrote:Ok Wally yours looks awesome so now I have a lot of questions....

I have a 73 Chevelle SS that my dad bought new and was my first car. For my birthday my wife just ought me the same LS3/430 connect and cruise as you have. I don't want to do any cutting in case I ever want to go back to original so....

What oil pan did you use? Cutting involved?
What accessory drive did you use?
What headers did you use?
What engine mounts?

What did you do for A/C? I want to keep my interior all original but nobody makes a kit for ours. Big surprise!

While I dont have LS3 in mine, I may be able to help.  I used a Cadillac CTS-V oil pan ( http://www.improvedracing.com/oil-pan-swap-kits/complete-oil-pan-swap-kit-for-ls2-ls6-lsa-cadillac-cts-p-383.html ) and car shop 1" setback plates ( http://carshop.carshopinc.com/product_info.php/products_id/98457/CSP2370 ) and bolted the stock motor mounts right to the plates, which will put the engine in the stock location. Now with that setup the ctsv pan will hang down below the front crossmember about 3/4", but thats not near as bad as it would be if you were to use the GM pan marketed as the "muscle car" pan ( http://www.jegs.com/p/Chevrolet-Performance/Chevrolet-Performance-LS-Muscle-Car-Oil-Pan-Kits/1221210/10002/-1 ), which would hang down another 1" past the ctsv pan.  Ctsv= 6.75" deep vs the "muscle car" = 7.75" deep.

Cant really be much help on the headers as i used stock 02 camaro manifolds on mine, but I know BRP/hedman sells swap headers for our cars ( http://www.brphotrods.com/products/73-77%20A%20body%20products/index.html ) but I cant speak on fitment as Ive never used them.  And for the accessories a corvette FAD should fit the car and work with the waterpump thats already on the motor ( http://www.jegs.com/i/Chevrolet-Performance/809/19155067/10002/-1 )

No Cadillac CTS-V oil pan did not fit. I used the Holley pan. I'll look up the parts numbers for you. I have tried many different parts and brackets only to still have them here on the self. And I have done two swaps so just let me dig up part number for you.

Thanks Alowerlevel and Wally.

I am going to add coilovers to mine to lower it and remember even with it stock the crossmember would hit on the street sometimes so the oil pan will have to be above it.

I was looking at the GM corvette accessory drive kit but with so much of these swaps going the info out there sucks. I could be wrong but it looks like the GM parts catalog says that to use the corvette drive package on the LS3/430 crate engine you have to replace the water pump and balancer that come with it. What a pain in the A$$! So I have a new engine with a new water pump and balancer and oil pan but now I have to go an buy an different water pump and balancer to use their accessory drive? I know there are many different applications for these but why don't they sell them with at least the muscle car pan? I don't think I have seen anybody able to use the pan that comes with these.

Looking forward to what works Wally.

I ended up after trying 3 different front drive accessory that kept tossing belts going with Holley.
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hly-20-138/overview/

Dirty dingo adjustable engine mounts. you will need them as they let you slide engine forward or backward 4" if your keeping the stock A/C set up.

Too much going on here tell weekend to get you all you want to know. Sorry but it maybe worth your wait as I spent a lot of money figuring it out.

No rush, I have to finish my wife's 51' ford pickup before I start on the Chevelle. I just want to get the parts figured out and only do this once.

Enjoy your holidays.

Wallyuph wrote:No Cadillac CTS-V oil pan did not fit.  I used the Holley pan. I'll look up the parts numbers for you. I have tried many different parts and brackets only to still have them here on the self. And I have done two swaps so just let me dig up part number for you.

Strange, the Ctsv pan fit my 73 just fine with the 1" setback plates I mentioned.  It actually went in just as easy as any sbc Ive ever installed, and I did the LS swap with the original trans still bolted in the car.

mikidymac wrote:Thanks Alowerlevel and Wally.

I am going to add coilovers to mine to lower it and remember even with it stock the crossmember would hit on the street sometimes so the oil pan will have to be above it.

I was looking at the GM corvette accessory drive kit but with so much of these swaps going the info out there sucks. I could be wrong but it looks like the GM parts catalog says that to use the corvette drive package on the LS3/430 crate engine you have to replace the water pump and balancer that come with it. What a pain in the A$$! So I have a new engine with a new water pump and balancer and oil pan but now I have to go an buy an different water pump and balancer to use their accessory drive? I know there are many different applications for these but why don't they sell them with at least the muscle car pan? I don't think I have seen anybody able to use the pan that comes with these.

Looking forward to what works Wally.

I would run the Holley pan then If your going to lower it, as it should be short enough to keep the sump above the x-member, the muscle car pan would hang below the x-member at least 1.5". Heres some measurements of oil pans http://www.improvedracing.com/tech/LS-oil-pan-dimensions.php

I think having to change the water pump and balancer for the vette FAD only applies to LS1/2 engines

Hello Wally, I wasn't going to rush you over the holidays but it looks like everybody's sales end the 31st so in a little bit of a pinch.

Specifically I was looking at the two Holley oil pans 302-1 and 302-2 but not sure which one and the Dirty Dingo adjustable engine mounts and Headman 1-3/4" long tube headers.

Any ideas if these will work?

Ok Here is what I know fits or works and what I ended up with for the final install and it working well.

1) Oil pan The Holley 302-1 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HLY-302-1 It fits nice and does not hang below the cross member.
The Ctsv pan would not go back to rear of cross member far enough as engine would hit fire wall and it hung down more.
Here is  spec sheet link for oil pans. http://www.improvedracing.com/tech/LS-oil-pan-dimensions.php
I used the Summit racing Chevrolet Performance 19212593 - Chevrolet Performance
Muscle car Oil Pan Kits NAL-19212593 on the Laguna and it fit fine but hangs down below the cross member by a 1” plus

2) Headers I used Holley  Hooker LS Cast Iron Exhaust Manifolds 8501-3HKR
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hok-8501-3hkr
They fit like stock exhaust manifolds Then ran 2&1/2" exhaust all the way out to back. That's the minimum size pipe recommended

3) Dirty dingo slider engine mounts.  Dingo Slider SBC or BBC to LS Conversion Engine Mounts http://dirtydingo.com/store/index.php?cPath=1_354_322  

4) Front drive accessories Holley LS Engine Swap Accessory Drive Systems 20-138 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hly-20-138  Front drive accessories Holley LS Engine Swap Accessory Drive Systems 20-138 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hly-20-138 and spacer braket Holley LS Engine Accessory Drive Application-Specific Installation Kits 21-1
and don’t for get to buy the power steer pump reservoir Holley LS Engine Power Steering Reservoir Kits 198-200 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hly-198-200/overview/

5) Fuel pump I used Aeromotive Phantom 340 Stealth Fuel Systems 18688 http://www.summitracing.com/parts/aei-18688  
Here is the pluming diagram http://aeromotiveinc.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Phantom-Stealth-Plumbing-Diagram.pdf I used #6 braided line from pump to engine bay and back and AN fittings

6) For your AC system you can use your stock set up you will just need to get two new hoses made for the ends that come off the compressor from Holley kit to you hook ups. And hydraulic hose making place will make them up for us if you have the fittings. I tucked up a Vintage Gen II AC system in mine and it will fit in behind the stock dash but that’s a lot of work if your system is good you can just swap out the hoses and you should be good to go.

7) I did not have to do any cutting but the drive shaft needs to be shortened and I measured it and took it in to have it shortened and balanced with two new u joints. The rear trans cross member only had to drill two new holes and it lined up with one set already in the Frame for me.

I used dual cooling fans Brushless 12” by spal with a variable temp sender that required me to drill and tap my water pump. They are new to the market and are not listed any where yet Pricy but nice. A set of dual electric fans should work fine for you.

9) Air filter we used Airraid 4” kit but was told by dealer NOT TO USE OIL type air filter as it gum’s up mass air flow sensor and Air raid make a non oil filter it’s called SynthaMax http://www.airaid.com/ProductDetail.aspx?ProductID=100-400

Ok, awesome list.

For the Holley 302-1 oil pan did you have any clearance issues with the steering link rods?

Did you try the GM performance Corvette accessory drive kit? is is quite a bit less expensive than the holley one?

Any particular reason you didn't go with headers?

Forgot to add why did you go with the 340 Phantom pump instead of the 200 that looks to be rated for our 430 HP?

mikidymac wrote:Ok, awesome list.

For the Holley 302-1 oil pan did you have any clearance issues with the steering link rods?

no problems at all for clearance

Did you try the GM performance Corvette accessory drive kit? is is quite a bit less expensive than the Holley one?

I did not know about them at the time and I was trying to get to var craft so I overnighted them. That's how i forgot the power steering reservoir

Any particular reason you didn't go with headers?

I hate tube header as they are so hard to get to clear every thing and they always seam to leak. These are cast iron headers. I have them on both the laguna with a 5.3 and the LS# in my 73 malibu. No cutting this way and no leaks. If you plan to keep your stock AC system these will be your best bet. I tried F body stock manifold but they hit the frame.

I had sanders Qp1000 cast iron ones on my 56 chevy with small block for 20 years with no gaskets and they never leaked or gave me any trouble.
http://www.sandersonheaders.com/Sanderson-QP1000-Cast-Series-Small-Block-Chevy-Header-Set.html

So I like cast iron ones as to me it all flows out and fits. They are still a header just not tubes like most are used to. Plus its not as hot by starter with all those tubes wrapped around it.

You can down load all of Holley instruction and parts list first to read through before you buy so you know what you are getting. after 3 sets of drive accessories I tried I just said enough and spent the funds and they worked great. The others use spacers out of tubing and when you get on it the snap of the throttle and letting off gas would make belt slip and even bent a bracket for idle pulley on me then belt would shred and make a mess. so I like that there is like factor camaro parts all the casting are X braced and bolt up nice to the block.

Feel free to use what ever you want all I know is I tried a cheaper route and it cost me more in the end let alone all the frustration. I'm just letting you know what worked for me.

I have chrome A/C compressor and brackets sitting on self now. What do you do with that now?

mikidymac wrote:Forgot to add why did you go with the 340 Phantom pump instead of the 200 that looks to be rated for our 430 HP?

I put a new tank in and wanted every thing new so while it was out that's what I went with. With all the issues i have been having and never know down the line if boosting may happen I wanted plenty of fuel if need be. So its just over kill really.

Bad news is I pinched a wire or some thing and now my fuel gauge doesn't work. Both wires at tank ground out so have to pull tank and see whats going on. I only used the sender from new tank and plugged the lines as the intake pump has all the fittings for vent and return line.

On this go with the 200 if you want. I saw the in tank one at SEMA show and thought that was a good idea as its in its own baffle so when you have a 1/4 tank and get on it all the fuel goes to back of tank and now you are fuel starved and bogging out. This in tank one dumps return line fuel back into foam baffle sponge so its not supposed to do that.

Wallyuph wrote:
I tried F body stock manifold but they hit the frame.

Its so odd that what fits in my 73 didnt in someone elses, I used a ctsv pan and '00 f-body manifolds with no major issues (had to pull 1 stud out of the pass side manifold and replace it with a nut & bolt).

On another note, how do you like your aeromotive in tank setup? Im thinking of getting rid of my external pump already and was looking into those.

alowerlevel wrote:

Wallyuph wrote:
I tried F body stock manifold but they hit the frame.

Its so odd that what fits in my 73 didnt in someone elses,  I used a ctsv pan and '00 f-body manifolds with no major issues (had to pull 1 stud out of the pass side manifold and replace it with a nut & bolt).

I have no clue to this but it would not slide back far enough and the pan was hitting the back side of front cross member. I even removed the break  line to get it to pop down and in but still no luck. The Holley pan is 1.5" shorter so its the way to go for no scrubbing the pan if you run over something. The F body manifolds and the ones that come on the LS3 both hit the frame on Pass side where the lower control arm attaches to the frame. Here is a photo of my Laguna with truck 5.3 setup and that engine mounts are for the A/C compressor mounted on lower pass side so engine sits way forward in the bay so that one I had to cut and notch with 1/4 plate steel to get exhaust to fit.  

THIS IS NOT MY 73  ITS MY 74 LAGUNA WITH THE 5.3 WITH STOCK A/C UNIT ON LOWER PASS SIDE. THE PHOTOS ARE FOR REFERENCE TO WHAT I'M SAYING
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On another note, how do you like your aeromotive in tank setup?  Im thinking of getting rid of my external pump already and was looking into those.

FUEL PUMP  Its working well I had to bend the sending unit as it hit the "bag for fuel pump by 1/8" and then cut off fuel lines going in from stock sending unit and plugged them to get the pump in that spot. I plane to run Aeromotive fuel pressure regulator and fuel filter and a return line back to the tank next spring. I have the parts here. I used the corvette fuel filter/regulator on frame rail right now but wide open throttle just at shift point it bogs as if its running out of fuel. " />
I have full pressure but we feel its a volume issue and the nipples are so small on that filer I think that's my issue. I have the same set up on the Laguna with a stock truck 5.3 setup and no problem at all with that one but it has a different intake and less horse power so that may be why it works. It also has a return line from fuel rail going back to the tank.
We will find out next spring. I ran 6 gauge wire back to the pump off the relay so I would not have any pump issues. I really tried to do my ho,me work on this after doing the laguna I learned a lot.
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Thanks for the info on the aeromotive setup, Im torn between swapping to a b-body tank or doing this to a stock tank.  I though I would be ok with the noise of a external pump...turns out Im not, lol.

I guess the difference must be in the motor mounts we used. Heres the best shot I can find of the fbody pass side manifold (theres at least 5/8" of clearance there, it just looks closer to the frame than it really is in the pic) Can also see theres still room between motor and firewall




And how the the ctsv pan fits my car (excuse the craptacular cell phone pics)

What mounts did you use?

The Holley pad is up higher for ground clearance.

I think you would be happy with the pump I can not here it. I here the fuel to the rail pressure build up as you first turn key but that is all. I can not here the pump at all when car is running. I used a brand new tank as they were not that much money.

I would guess the engine mounts make a difference as all of the brands are a little different an make the claim they will only work with their accessories.

New fuel tanks are available at OPGI for $150 and are on sale until Christmas eve.

I am surprised you have issues with that fuel filter/reg combo, weren't those from the corvette with about the same power? That is what I was planning on using.

Going to have to call Dirty Dingo too because they offer the mounts you used but also list these too... http://dirtydingo.com/store/index.php?cPath=1_354_324&CDpath=8

I am going to order the Holley 302-1 pan and give them a call to see how their A/C bracket will work with the Corvette accessory drive kit.

Now I have the rethink the headers will probably ask Holley about the cast iron ones since they sell both.

Thank you so much for the info I know it has helped me and will others.

mikidymac wrote:I would guess the engine mounts make a difference as all of the brands are a little different an make the claim they will only work with their accessories.

New fuel tanks are available at OPGI for $150 and are on sale until Christmas eve.

I am surprised you have issues with that fuel filter/reg combo, weren't those from the corvette with about the same power? That is what I was planning on using.

Going to have to call Dirty Dingo too because they offer the mounts you used but also list these too... http://dirtydingo.com/store/index.php?cPath=1_354_324&CDpath=8

I am going to order the Holley 302-1 pan and give them a call to see how their A/C bracket will work with the Corvette accessory drive kit.

Now I have the rethink the headers will probably ask Holley about the cast iron ones since they sell both.

Thank you so much for the info I know it has helped me and will others.

I used those mounts on my Laguna as its states they will fit with the AC compressor in lower mount. They fit but we had to shim them by a few washers and they do not let you slide it if you have the AC in stock lower passenger side. Engine sits way forward in the bay with them. That's why I went with the other sliders.the Dingo Slider SBC or BBC to LS Conversion Engine Mounts



See these photos of Laguna with DD-3500C mounts
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If you do not have stock lower AC compressor mounted on you may be able to get it back further but with it mounted on the back of AC compressor hits the mount brackets and frame so only a 1/2" adjustment and we had to add shims to get mounts to line up on cross member.

Wow, that does sit far forward. With the slider mounts you recommend what do you use to connect them to the frame, stock rubber? They look flat in the pictures whereas the other ones have the tabs that hang down.

Yep your stock mounts bolt right up to them. Then you can drop it in and push,pry and pull tell you get it where you want it and tighten up slider bolts.

Do you have any preference to the polyurethane vs. stock rubber ones?

I like stock rubber less vibration with them

Wallyuph wrote:What mounts did you use?

The Holley pad is up higher for ground clearance.

I think you would be happy with the pump I can not here it. I here the fuel to the rail pressure build up as you first turn key but that is all. I can not here the pump at all when car is running. I used a brand new tank as they were not that much money.

I used Car Shop 1" setback plates ( http://carshop.carshopinc.com/product_info.php/products_id/98457/CSP2370 ) and bolted the stock motor mounts from the 307 right to the plates, which put the engine in the stock location, and bolted right up to the factory th350 that we never even removed from the car.  You can see the plates bolted between the block and the motor mount in the 2nd pic I posted above.

Yeah the holley pan is about 1" shorter than the ctsv but also about 2x's the price of what I paid for the ctsv pan and I was on a strict budget for this swap.

Damn now you really got me thinking about going with the aeromotive setup, think Ill wait till I do the turbo kit though.

Beautiful ride! I used to have a car that had dealer installed mud flaps. Guy used to rag me all the time about " Great car if only you'd get rid of those ugly flaps" Told him for $14,000 I'd gladly remove them. Never heard another word.